Tank Size
- Thread starter Brucemg
- Start date
Kanga
Retired Moderator
Bruce that will take a pretty decent pump
Kanga
Retired Moderator
Any good hardware store will have, try Builders etc, Just make sure you get the Marine silicone as the others have a fungicide in them to prevent mould
Bruce, what size is your display tank? Basically, the volume of water in display which will run down to the sump (i.e. area of the display tank x depth of water above overflow) + volume of water in skimmer, other filters and pipes should all fit into the sump, with another 5% (minimum, IMHO) available in the sump as safety margin.
With all power off, my sump fills up to about 7mm from the top - that's about 60 litres of water space still available before it overflows.
Hennie
With all power off, my sump fills up to about 7mm from the top - that's about 60 litres of water space still available before it overflows.
Hennie
OK, so that's 10.1 litres per mm of water height in display - and with a safety margin of 5% that becomes 10.6 litres per millimetre of water height. Using this info, you would thus need 1.8mm of sump "free bore" for every 1.0mm of water overflow height in the display tank, excluding water volume in skimmer, pipes and filters (if any...).
In my opinion you don't want (or need...) the very last baffle between the DSB and pump chamber - the one where the water is forced to flow underneath the baffle - as it just wastes space without contributing anything positive. I would rather increase the return pump chamber by that 100mm, and just use the single "overflow" baffle.
I would further suggest that when you build the sump, you initially leave out all the baffles (but install the skimmer and whatever filters you plan to use...), and hook it up "live" to the display tank. You can then start with a safe sump water level (say 100mm below the top) and measure the actual water level increase when all the power is switched off. This will make it much easier to accurately design the optimum water level in the sump, which will be controlled by the top level of that last baffle between the DSB and the pump chamber (I think you would be able to increase it quite a bit higher than shown in your drawings). Remember that the water level in the pump chamber is a compromise between the maximum safe "water-return-after-power-failure" level and the minimum "days-before-pump-chamber-runs-dry-when-you're-away-and-the-auto-top-up fails" level. Personally, I would try to maximise the latter, but still keep a safe maximum level to prevent flooding.
Hennie
In my opinion you don't want (or need...) the very last baffle between the DSB and pump chamber - the one where the water is forced to flow underneath the baffle - as it just wastes space without contributing anything positive. I would rather increase the return pump chamber by that 100mm, and just use the single "overflow" baffle.
I would further suggest that when you build the sump, you initially leave out all the baffles (but install the skimmer and whatever filters you plan to use...), and hook it up "live" to the display tank. You can then start with a safe sump water level (say 100mm below the top) and measure the actual water level increase when all the power is switched off. This will make it much easier to accurately design the optimum water level in the sump, which will be controlled by the top level of that last baffle between the DSB and the pump chamber (I think you would be able to increase it quite a bit higher than shown in your drawings). Remember that the water level in the pump chamber is a compromise between the maximum safe "water-return-after-power-failure" level and the minimum "days-before-pump-chamber-runs-dry-when-you're-away-and-the-auto-top-up fails" level. Personally, I would try to maximise the latter, but still keep a safe maximum level to prevent flooding.
Hennie
Hi Hennie
Thanks for info i will do the theory calcs and see. All boils down to the practical as you explained about fitting all peripherals to the sump before the baffles.
My initial thoughts, to build the sump first then the display then the stand as soon as cash is available.
I also intend to fit a drip tray [304 s/s] under the sump in the base of my stand which will also help if there is a over flow. Promised the wife I will take all care not to have a flooding.
Ive also increased the height but 30mm as Ive got space. Will remove the second baffle in the return chamber[just look nice] and I see your point of water return to the return chamber if there is a power failure so a bigger volume would be better.
Thanks for info i will do the theory calcs and see. All boils down to the practical as you explained about fitting all peripherals to the sump before the baffles.
My initial thoughts, to build the sump first then the display then the stand as soon as cash is available.
I also intend to fit a drip tray [304 s/s] under the sump in the base of my stand which will also help if there is a over flow. Promised the wife I will take all care not to have a flooding.
Ive also increased the height but 30mm as Ive got space. Will remove the second baffle in the return chamber[just look nice] and I see your point of water return to the return chamber if there is a power failure so a bigger volume would be better.
Agree with Viper, eurobracing is the way to go. Also interesting, I learnt about building tanks. Once you have put the tank and braces together and totally set, but before putting water in, is hang off the sides of the tank. If it can't handle your own body weight with sideways force, its not safe.
Also rather have a failure without water.
Also rather have a failure without water.
hi brucemg, please allow me to say a few words on why 99.99% of tanks fracture. and maybe you can bear it in mind with the final design of your tank - under normal use tanks fracture because two factors, and ONLY two factors were present at the time of failure. one. he glass was under stress and two. the pane under stress was scratched - for stress read "bowing" and if you minimise the bow your tank will be safer. therefore adequate thickness of glass for the size/volume and correct placement of bracing strips on long shaped tanks - however levelling of the tank is super important for the avoidance of stress/bowing - now as regards the scratching the most vunerable panes are the front and back faces - and it is on the OUTER FACES that are under stress when the tank is filled. the least vunerable is the base sheet of the tank - provided that the tank is absolutely level and there is a minimum of compressionable material under the tank itself- glass never breaks under compression so the inside surface of the "bow" can accommodate some scratching
and you have seen how many tanks are scratched inside yet last forever? but let no one near your tank if they then intend to tap on the glass (metal ball point pens a favourite) quick sum up - heavy scratch but no stress = no fracture high stress but pristine surface = no fracture combine the two = "wet carpet syndrome"
when i was on the reef i gave a lecture/demo on why tanks burst and demostrated with sheet glass - youve never seen so many scared aquarists!! but from then on we never had another tank fracture - keeping a fishtank in one piece is not rocket science - it simply means correct thickness of glass - correct bracing - correct base support for the mass of the tank and most important an absolute level tank when filled give me a PM if i can be of any further help cheers dave
Kanga
Retired Moderator
Thanks for that Dave really nice info there
Thanks All
Dave when I complete and happy with the design I will post again as I dont want a desaster.That whats great about MASA all the knowledge is out there just to gather and make it work.
Viper more tips on eorubracing and btm bracing I not sure what eoru is.
I have asked this before I used a SF of 2 in the calcs for the glass thickness. WHat is the norm for SF.
Another one is when doing the cutting list how much gap[mm] must be between the viewing pains for the silcon e.g. if the tank base is 1000mm x 700 will the cut be 995 for the side pain[along the 1000mm] and 700mm for the side short pain or what.
Dave when I complete and happy with the design I will post again as I dont want a desaster.That whats great about MASA all the knowledge is out there just to gather and make it work.
Viper more tips on eorubracing and btm bracing I not sure what eoru is.
I have asked this before I used a SF of 2 in the calcs for the glass thickness. WHat is the norm for SF.
Another one is when doing the cutting list how much gap[mm] must be between the viewing pains for the silcon e.g. if the tank base is 1000mm x 700 will the cut be 995 for the side pain[along the 1000mm] and 700mm for the side short pain or what.
Mike
Retired Moderator
Depending on the partitioning of the sump, it may not actually need top bracing, but you could put braces along the sides of the tank (called euro-bracing id SA i believe)