Yip over the past 12 years I have seen a huge decline in the corner cafe. The corner cafe owner has either been lucky enough to buy a spar, friendly grocer or 7/11 or gone back overseas. Pick 'n Pay, Woolworths, checkers, Shell ect have taken over. Its sad as the corner cafe owner employed more people and offered better conditions than the chains.
Price fixing
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Yip over the past 12 years I have seen a huge decline in the corner cafe. The corner cafe owner has either been lucky enough to buy a spar, friendly grocer or 7/11 or gone back overseas. Pick 'n Pay, Woolworths, checkers, Shell ect have taken over. Its sad as the corner cafe owner employed more people and offered better conditions than the chains.
leslie hempel
Professional Aquarist
Do you guys honestly believe that marines are the only sorce of the LFS's income? many diversify, dog food (small margins but high turnover) birds, dogs cats, hamsters rabbits and all their acessories are sold at REASONABLE prices, why cant marines be the same? fish i can understand because of freight and mortality and to a point the equipment (if equipment is to float the losses of the livestock side of the buisnes) but its ridiculious.
Its at a stage where new people cant enter the hobby and buy reasonable equipment and almost have to get ripped off buying a jebo to get into the game..
Why buy a skimmer for R6k when you see one for R500 (a newby wont know the difference and purchase the latter)
He will loose more fish due to the price of equipment putting it out of his reach..
im all for somone making a profit, it is necessary for survival in any buisness.. But at least use vaseline..
yes, for Dorry Pets and Idol Marine
@Alan, my opinion, the LFS have to have a certain mark up, just to be able to pay his fixed monthly expenses. No point arguing that part.
BUT, what I do not know is what is the mark up of the distributor? because the LFS mark up is on top of that.
That is why we could end up with double the European rates.
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leslie hempel
Professional Aquarist
Then perhaps then they should look into diversifying.. or would you rather have the entire country pay higer prices uncecessarily for 2 stores to be able to survive?
That's life my friend and generally the consumer is better off. Who says the cafe owner offered better employment conditions (no pension fund, medical aid, etc).
My dad (may he rest in peace) had a corner cafe for 50 yrs plus and it is still going. Not making the same profit as before but my brother's who run it employ the same no. of staff, but there's no benefits for staff (never was). Hours are long and you work flipping hard.
That's why he made sure his kids all went to university and became professionals. The retail induistry is evolving all the time. Consumers are generally looking for the best price subject to decent quality and service levels. With the advent of the internet we have access to almost unlimited information and products. Before I buy anything, I research it on the internet -we know what kind of advice most LFS's give. They just want to sell their product.
I dont think its only two stores- I know a few in my area that specialise in marines. I always find these kinds of threads interesting- seems to me that many reefers want their pet shop owners and the wholesalers to not make a decent income. Ironic considering how many reefers themselves are rather well off
leslie hempel
Professional Aquarist
its a good debate, weather something will come of it or not its actually irrelevant, it would be nice to see better prices for new people who are interested in the hobby to be able to justify entering it at the prices offered and at current those prices are heavy..
There is nothing wrong with making a decent income but killing it to an extent where people are deterred from participating is another slow death the LFS will face in future..
If you knew what the margins were on some of the items it would really open your eyes...
having a double cab as "official company delivery vehicle"
I think they ok, lasting longer than Tr.. (now I'm going to get nailed big time)
yeah, like buying a Jebo from big diversified pet shop. One that can and do have a lot of additional income from other products. Then and there I do not agree. And fully stand by you.
Where for the same cost, he could get a lot better system from a specializing shop.
But this is another argument.
My point is,
any shop must reach a specific minimum income per month to be able to budget for at least the fixed monthly cost. And each and every sale(big and small) contribute to that. And 30% as mark up rate, works out to a lot of turnover. Less mark up and a hell of an increase of turnover.
Whenever the shop follows the recommended advertise price or not. He have to mark up to have an income. If he discounts too much, he will affect his turnover. Does not matter if its a LFS, hardware or corner cafe
I do actually know the margins on the items.... and I dont really find it that shocking to be honest. Considering holding stock, shipping costs, dealing with faulty parts, spares etc I think the markup is probably about right (OK, maybe a bit steep, but not excessively so). When I think of the money that a lot of reefers earn each month, it really isnt a problem for me. What I find offensive is wealthy people complaining how other people make their money (and Im not pointing fingers at specific people here- its just an observation)
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That is true. Consumers want te better deal, the lower costs. Yes , im guilty to sometimes, but 1 question is what is a decent income ? enough to stay in a nice house, with a nice car etc, or a mansion and a porche in the garage for sundays ? Yes, they earn it buy working hard and taking risks, but there is a thin line between making money, and making a living
I support a few marine shops , mostly our sponsors here. I have found that they almost always give me a good deal, they are more than willing to assist with any info i need etc.
At the end of the day, I believe that it up to the shop you support. Its at their descrepency if they rip you off , or if they value you as a customer.
leslie hempel
Professional Aquarist
and a good observation and excellent of you to participate.. the more healthy opinions we have the better the discussion.
That is true. Consumers want te better deal, the lower costs. Yes , im guilty to sometimes, but 1 question is what is a decent income ? enough to stay in a nice house, with a nice car etc, or a mansion and a porche in the garage for sundays ? Yes, they earn it buy working hard and taking risks, but there is a thin line between making money, and making a living
I support a few marine shops , mostly our sponsors here. I have found that they almost always give me a good deal, they are more than willing to assist with any info i need etc.
At the end of the day, I believe that it up to the shop you support. Its at their descrepency if they rip you off , or if they value you as a customer.
Considering that marines is not a cheap hobby, all Im saying is that we as reefers shouldnt be hypocritical about what the LFS or wholesalers earn. Im aware of some attorneys and engineers etc have serious chargeout rates . People who do tenders for government and state entities also make a bucket- people dont seem to really take such umbridge at that (well I dont hold it against them- thats life- not everyone earns the same amount)
Also I dont think we as ignorant hobbyests know what the LFS or wholesalers actually take home each month- its all speculation as we do not know overheads and other expenses such as losses
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viper357
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Ok guys, thank you for everyones input, it has been very interesting reading all the comments, the thread however has run it's course and before it turns into a thread of speculation and false accusations etc. I think it best to end off on a high note. Thank you.
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