Undesireable and Protected species List

[Kanga]

Sunburst came up with the brilliant idea that we start a list of local caught species that should not be kept by aquarists in their aquariums
as well as a list that should not be sold by LFS's

For one i believe we should start by listing local(In Masa) species that are threatened or stand little chance of survival in captivity(will inevitably make poachers aware as well). And then follow up with a species list that should not be kept or purchased (LFS) for the same reasons. eg Certain anemones and goniopora species

Also Thalion came up with the idea to add photographs (another brilliant idea)

Then Viper came up with the brainfart that we do it ourselves

So here is the thread, help

 

[calvin]

well ill start with the following

moorish idol

harlequin filefish

all seahorses

all pipefish

marleyii butterfly

maypole butterfly

regal angel

achilis tang

mothfish (pegasus draconus)

plue spotted stingray

pacific stingray

electric ray

blue ribbon eel

cat sharks

reef sarks

 

[calvin]

Oh just to add many of these species can be kept with great success by many reefkeepers! however I feel that importers should only bring them in on special orders for tank owners capible of careing for them roperly!

 

[viper357]

Moorish Idol - Zanclus canescens (not to be confused with the "poor mans moorish idol" which is a Heniochus acuminatus, also known as a Bannerfish)

These fish have a very dismal survival rate in aquariums, there are very few recorded success story's with this fish, it is best avoided.

 

[Mike]

I hope you don't mind me commenting here, but i have seen in the UK some LFS are large companys' that have outlets in garden centres etc, they do not always ask for some of the stock that comes in, i've seen sweetlips around 50cm's long that look really pretty and unless the staff are well trained (sadly mostly not) the unwary tank owner could walk away with a fish that can grow to 60-70cm's long and how many of us could actually keep a fish that long.
Also Dendro's and cataphylia both difficult to keep as Millipora advised in another thread that you would do well to keep a non-photosynthetic denro for more than 6 months.
So my point is then, it is up to us to research every purchase - with te collective brains on this and many other forums there really is no excuse to impulse buy and fish or coral only to watch it wither and die in our little glass water filled boxes.
As for local caught species, those of you that dive in the local areas MUST know whether or not the local populations can afford to lose "one or two" of any given species.

 

[calvin]

blue spotted stingray

pacific stingray

blue ribbon eel

 

[Kanga]

Somewhere along the line we are just going to have to find a way to decide what should be included and what not

Any ideas?

So far this will be all suggestions to avoid upsetting some guy who has had forty moorish idols and all did well in captivity hence the 40

 

[calvin]

I have fish that I feel should never be imported unless by special order by advanced reefers

 

[Mike]

Somewhere along the line we are just going to have to find a way to decide what should be included and what not

Any ideas?

So far this will be all suggestions to avoid upsetting some guy who has had forty moorish idols and all did well in captivity hence the 40

Could the reccomendations be graded from "bullet proof, would survive even the biggest bunglers mistakes" to "Advanced reefers only" many types of fish can do well if the tank is big enough or mature enough in the capable hands of experienced folk, but many will not.

 

[Kanga]

Could the reccomendations be graded from "bullet proof, would survive even the biggest bunglers mistakes" to "Advanced reefers only" many types of fish can do well if the tank is big enough or mature enough in the capable hands of experienced folk, but many will not.

Good thinking there weeman

 

[viper357]

Wee-Man makes a good point (for a change)

I think let the guys put in their input then we can work from there with all the info we have and put the fish/corals on a grading system from beginner to advanced or something like that. Like Calvin said, some species can be successful if kept by advanced reefers or in species specific tanks etc.

 

[Steve Warren]

In principal this is a good idea, however in the Southern and southern part of the Eastern Cape, recommendations on locally caught species are not as important as they are further North. The juveniles of tropical species come down in the warmer months but die in Winter with the cold water upwellings and have no or little impact to the reproduction of the species. But, if guys wish to stick to lists and not keep the difficult species then they can always donate them to the local public aquarium if the aquarium wants them.
For instance, I know of several aquarists locally who still have Moorish Idols from last season, I have often found them to do well if treated like surgeons (lots of algae), but some others are successful with them eating on their corals and star polyps.
Doublesash B/flies should not be kept in Tropical tanks (as Calvin mentions), but in temperate and cold water tanks do extremely well (they eat a lot of terebellid worms).
I think suggestions and recommendations are important but should not be overly restrictive to the development of new methods and technologies.
Think of what used to be thought about SPS!
Also with the knowledge of DSB techniques, nowadays keeping of marine tanks and inhabitants is no harder than keeping freshwater tanks properly (possibly even easier).

 

[Kanga]

In principal this is a good idea, however in the Southern and southern part of the Eastern Cape, recommendations on locally caught species are not as important as they are further North. The juveniles of tropical species come down in the warmer months but die in Winter with the cold water upwellings and have no or little impact to the reproduction of the species. But, if guys wish to stick to lists and not keep the difficult species then they can always donate them to the local public aquarium if the aquarium wants them.

Agreed a moorish has a much much better chance in a tank rather than when the water gets colder here in EC.

I think this list should be more for animals brought in by importers and LFS's, also fish in areas where they would survive.

However lots of input would be needed, this point is something I never thought of, but makes absolute sense.

 

[Steve Warren]

Hi Kanga
I agree, also with enough knowledge of who locally is more successful with the more difficult species then ideally if someone manages to catch one, they could get advise and if they see it is not working then rather give the fish to someone who has more experience with it; rather than letting it go too far downhill. In my opinion it should not be released again, as if it is tropical it would be giving it a death sentence in winter. The risk of introducing diseases that local fish have no immunity to should also be considered if it has been held with imported species.

 

[Kanga]

Hi Kanga
I agree, also with enough knowledge of who locally is more successful with the more difficult species then ideally if someone manages to catch one, they could get advise and if they see it is not working then rather give the fish to someone who has more experience with it; rather than letting it go too far downhill. In my opinion it should not be released again, as if it is tropical it would be giving it a death sentence in winter. The risk of introducing diseases that local fish have no immunity to should also be considered if it has been held with imported species.

Agreed 100%

 

[Warr7207]

blue spotted stingray

pacific stingray

blue ribbon eel

All these creatures look like they in reef tanks ? How come, endangered ?

 

[LikesFish]

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=1157901