The best way to set up a new tank?

Discussion in 'General Discussions and Advice' started by Tiger eye, 20 Jun 2013.

  1. Tiger eye

    Tiger eye

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    Hi guys. I'm planning on setting up my new tank shortly and was wondering what is the best way of going about this.
    The one option is to set up the new tank with a new sump and let it cycle and then transfer the live stock.
    Or maybe set up the tank and put the live stock in drums and move the old sump over to the new tank and when everything is settled down transfer the live stock. But how long can the live stock stay in the drums and what do I need to keep them alive and as little stressed as possible?
    I am not going to use a DSB again.
     
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  3. pkc

    pkc

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    Beds of media are a must, externally of course!
    The aquarium I would leave bare for now, just some ocean water or a few buckets from some ones matured aquarium and your made up water with it if thats what you will do and build large wall barrier of filter wool-pre filter that catches everything as the water leaves the aquarium that I can slide out easily to rinse off under the hose with strong pressure each day.
    I would build a very complex sump of multiple types of media including beds of granule sized calcium at 3 to 8 millimetres and incorporate a small skimmer at the end of the sump that is not switched on until the full cycle to early maturity is achieved.
    Make the sump so that you can incorporate a large plastic tub above it of an algae bed established onto chunks of dead rock of 20 to 50 mill three high with only 8 to 10 inches of water depth above the chunks on a raised egg crate floor 30 mill up of the floor that you can reach easily to trim the algae and clean off cyano with a small paint brush when it appears. I use just basic led fluro replacement tubes of quarter watt 60 degree optic diodes of 50/50 blue and cool white at ten watts each tube, one for each four inches of width of algae bed.
    Build one settling chamber per 2 thousand litres of flow through external bio filters top prevent any thing beyond water soluble organic matter from getting to your sump, or it will not work in time.
    Hang a bag of marinara in the aquarium to seed with varied ammonias until ammonia levels peak very high, now add some media somewhere near the start of your external bio filter from some ones matured aquarium that will have matured intense protista communities if you can. From now on keep shaking the bag each day or so until it is nearly dissolved, add more, this needs to be done until no ammonia or nitrite shows on a test.
    Once the sump system is biologically far to strong for ammonia or nitrite to show at all, do a massive water change and add very open base rock, not live rock and switch on wave makes or similar from then on!
    Hang a small bag of marinara in your sump as you build up inverts in the display aquarium and some small section of live rock with colour. Start skimmer and Finish adding inverts as in corals, shrimps, etc, completely, before you add fish of any kind!
    Now do regular water changes for 6 months and from then on,when you think the tank needs a water change.After that length of time,i do a water change twice a year,maybe,thats up to you,if all bio sections,including the algae, is done righ,there is no need for a water change ever again!
    For mew it should be,aquarium,pre filter,algae,settling pre filters,bio filter,sump with skimmer and bubble defusing sponge,return pump,done!
    But that’s how I have always done mine and friends for over 30 years now, hope what ever you do works well for you.
     
    Last edited: 20 Jun 2013
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  4. dallasg

    dallasg Moderator MASA Contributor

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    Come to the meeting on sat in midrand and everybody there can help, Irma has a great tank and no sump to see
     
  5. Tiger eye

    Tiger eye Thread Starter

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    I would love to come to the meeting but I'm working saterday.
     
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  6. Visser

    Visser MASA Contributor

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    To answer your question..
    On my newest frag tank, i moved all my corals to a shallow large "tub/bucket" with about 50% water (&couple LR pieces) from my old system & rest fresh water. I simply added a small powerhead, heater & light...
    I then took all the lr from the old tank & added it to the sump of the new tank, & then pumped all the "clean" water over to the new system (which was about 60% of the new tank & topped it up with fresh salt water.
    The tank never even showed signs of cycling, (tested daily) but i anyhow left it 2weeks before transferring corals.
    Its been running for 3weeks now. 2days ago, my hammer corals all spawned at the same time, which was a good indication that everything was happy!
     
  7. RiaanP

    RiaanP Moderator

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    Must the new tank stand in the same place as the old one?

    I would try to run both sumps together for a few weeks, if possible.

    What would be your biological filtration on your new sump?

    Just note, the biggest issue with moving tanks is temperature differences.
    If new tank must go where the old tank is standing, that means double work. All water into tubs / drums. Move old tank out of the way, place new tank. and refill it.
    Else
    Can move everything directly over from old into new. A lot less work, and faster. Less temperature issues.
     
  8. Tiger eye

    Tiger eye Thread Starter

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    Ill be using Bio-Cubes and a Carbon reactor.

    Yes due to space restrictions I dont have a nother place to put it.
     
  9. RiaanP

    RiaanP Moderator

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    can you run both sumps together for 2 weeks?
     
  10. Tiger eye

    Tiger eye Thread Starter

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    I'm probably going to sound like a compleet idiot. But can you explain how do I run 2 sumps and what is the benifit if I am not going to keep the DSB.
     
  11. dallasg

    dallasg Moderator MASA Contributor

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    the short answer, there is no best way, there is the way that you feel comfortable with with regards to time and budget, understanding the processes involved will be best.
     
  12. Tiger eye

    Tiger eye Thread Starter

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    I told my wife what you sed so she agreed that I can run the old tank in the hallway until the new tank is setup and reddy and then just transfer the live stock.
     
  13. Smithers

    Smithers

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    I had/have the same dilemma at the moment. I ended up getting a new sump and will run the two systems independently for a while. I will be filling the new tank with a mix of synthetic, NSW and matured water from my current tank. I'm then going to add as much live rock from my current tank and then leave that for a couple of weeks. The wait will kill me but in the end it is worth it. Can you not use something like Seachem Stabilty to kick start it all?
     
  14. RiaanP

    RiaanP Moderator

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    You already have livestock
    The cubes take 2 weeks at least to mature.
    So what will be your main biological filtration for those 2 weeks?
    If you can get the one sump to overflow to the other for those 2 weeks... yeah, gap closed.

    To do that use 50mm PVC to siphon water from the one to the other. Just as you would siphon water out via a flexible hose. To help get the air out, drill a 6mm hole at the highest point, insert a airline hose with a tap in it, suck the air out with your mouth. close tap. There, siphon started. Check every second day that air pocket did not form in the connection.
     
  15. RiaanP

    RiaanP Moderator

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    All you need is 1 * T-piece, 1 * 90 elbow, 1 * female end cap and a few short pieces of 50mm pipe.

    Short piece vertical. T-p on top, T going out horizontally to the side. Female end cap at the top (highest point). At other sump, 90 degree downwards and last 50mm pipe.

    Can cut both the downpipes with a 45 degree angle so that they can stand on the glass bottom, without blocking themselves. then no need to try and suspend the contraption.
     
  16. dallasg

    dallasg Moderator MASA Contributor

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    cubes take anywhere from 2-14 days... they are only for nitrate and po4 removal not biological
     
  17. RiaanP

    RiaanP Moderator

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    mechanical
    biological
    chemical

    Filtration fall into one of those 3 groups.
    Where do you put the cubes then?
     
  18. dallasg

    dallasg Moderator MASA Contributor

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    under nutrient export where most carbon dosing and nutrient export should be, new advances call for new categories, but given those 3, it would be chemical in my eyes
     
  19. dallasg

    dallasg Moderator MASA Contributor

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    rather than how they work, its what they do, biological will cause confusion and possibly lead to them being used the wrong way, same as np pellets
     
  20. RiaanP

    RiaanP Moderator

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    NP pellets is biological. Stop the flow into the reactor and the bacteria dies. Much faster than the bacteria in a DSB.
    Cubes is biological. Got yeast growing on the cubes.

    The classification should not be in what they do. Actually they all use some form of bacteria or yeast or micro organisms or macro algae. So they do the same thing.
    It is in our misunderstanding of how these products work that is the problem. And the word "products" is the wrong word to use as well in this context. Better to use the term "SOLUTION".
    As in, what is your solution for nutrient export.


    Anyway, back to the topic at hand.
    There is a gap in between the old system thrown out and the new system. where the nutrient export is not active in the new. Be it that the old system export mechanism is not optimal, therefor the change over to another solution. But even if not at optimal, at least it still does some nutrient export. Even at 75%, it is still better than nothing.

    That is why I stand by my suggestion, where if it is possible at all to be able to run both sumps for at least 2 weeks in series. That it would be the best option to take.

    If this is not an option, then do the change over, and check the water parameters at least every second day. Bigger 20% water changes every second day might be needed, frequency decreases as the cubes get into action. Hopefully its quickly, with minimal impact on his corals. Softies would actually not mind a bit of phosphates.
     
    Last edited: 24 Jun 2013
  21. dallasg

    dallasg Moderator MASA Contributor

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    but we need to add a nutrient export category as its valid these days. there is no misunderstanding i know exactly how the cubes work. they are products that form part of a solution.

    NoPox does the same and its not bacterial, it might cause bacterial growth etc so its chemical, seachem de-nitrate is biological, they would all suit a new category

    time to think out the box and start a revolution
     
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