SPS STN WTD(what to do?)

Discussion in 'SPS Corals' started by Broder, 21 Aug 2009.

  1. Broder

    Broder Mudshark

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    I've recently had some calcium issues in my tank. It shot up to 600 ppm as I reduced my alk levels. I want to try to keep them closer to 7-8 dkh for the very reason that high levels seem to demand higher calcium dosing. Before anyone asks, yes I have ordered another Ca test kit and will compare when I get it. Would tis fluctuation bring on STN, or should I be looking for other causes? If so, what?

    Here is the affected acropora. It has bleached and has STN around the base. What can I do?
    [​IMG]
     
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  3. Mekaeel

    Mekaeel Moderator MASA Contributor

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    Mudshark, really sorry to hear man. Is it only that one particular piece that is affected?
    If there was a huge Ca and Alk swing in a low nutrient system like yours, it can/will cause STN/RTN.
    In the mean time, monitor that piece. If you notice the tissue necrosis spreading, you going to have to frag it.
     
  4. Shaun

    Shaun Retired Moderator

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    If it is spreading remove it and frag it asap. Also with high ca levels keep an eye on your pumps as they may have a ca build up inside them as well.
     
  5. Broder

    Broder Thread Starter Mudshark

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    Thanks Mek. I unfortunately lost my acro granulosa as well. That bleached and got rtn in the space of 3 days. That's when I decided to bring levels down to NSW parameters. The acro with STN had started to look pale by then already, another reason I wanted to try something... anything.
    Thanks Shaun. You're right... I had noticed the calcium buildup in pumps.
     
  6. Mekaeel

    Mekaeel Moderator MASA Contributor

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    Damn. So which means this whole tissue necrosis scenario stared before you actually went about changing the Ca and Alk levels then?
    Anything that you could have dosed that lead to this issue?
     
  7. Broder

    Broder Thread Starter Mudshark

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    Yes Mek. The alk was very high, about 11, so that may have caused the corals to stress and then the rapid imbalance after that could have pushed them over the edge? I'm just guessing, but that's all we can really do I suppose. I havn't dosed anything else to my knowledge, but with NSW you never really know hey?
     
  8. Mekaeel

    Mekaeel Moderator MASA Contributor

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    Guaranteed high Alk caused the problem Broder. High alk especially in a low nutrient system causes Tissue Necrosis. I highly doubt it was the water used bud. When running a low nutrient/ nutrient poor system, it is best to keep your Alk within NSW ranges, 6.5-8.5 DKH (recommended on Zeovit.com).
     
  9. Broder

    Broder Thread Starter Mudshark

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    Thanks for that Mek. I was never sure which way to go. Now I know. I'm aiming for 7-8 dkh and 400-450ppm calcium right?
     
  10. Adee

    Adee

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    That range is perfect....stability of keeping it there is the trick.

    I keep mine at 8dkh with Ca at 430ppm....how often to do test for Mg and do u dose iodine?
     
  11. Broder

    Broder Thread Starter Mudshark

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    No iodine, Adee, as I do weekly 15% NSW changes. Mg is about 1380ppm.
     
  12. Adee

    Adee

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    Is this problem on your skimmerless system?

    Powerfull skimming would remove iodine, as I have nevered used NSW (Jozi) for water changes, I can't comment what concentrations NSW would come in, and that compounded with a weeks use from your corals in between water changes.

    Only reason I asked I came near close to looseing all my sps's, bleached/burnt tips and pale looking corals. Thinking that weekly water changes added back enough iodine into my system, I was wrong as the brand of salt I was using at the time was crap.

    So I changed salt brands and started dosing Iodine daily.

    Just a heads up, in case u still have issues after bring your alk/Ca levels in check.
     
  13. Broder

    Broder Thread Starter Mudshark

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    Yeah.... thanks Adee, it is on the skimmerless system. I read up on iodine awhile ago, and came to the conclusion that it's unlikely that a skimmerless system would be low on iodine. I'm a bit worried about overdosing as well as I can't measure levels. Can you recommend an affordable and usable testkit?
     
  14. Manic

    Manic Moderator

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    If you don't mind could you please tell me what salt you were using and what you have now changed to. I was using Tropic Marine pro-reef which is really expensive (R1200 for 20Kg). I've heard this salt isn't really that good if you aren't running a calcium reactor. Today I bought the aqua medic salt (It's much cheaper as well, R750 for 20Kg). Any one had experience with this salt? Was it a good buy or is there still better salt?

    Sorry for going off topic...
     
  15. Mekaeel

    Mekaeel Moderator MASA Contributor

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    Alk is fine Mudshark .Ca 380-420 (NSW levels) but most of us including me keep calcium around 430-450.

    Manic. It AM is a good salt, I used it in the past, but TM is still better.
    For R750.00 you could get your hands on some Instant Ocean which also a very good brand and also high in trace elements. Instant Ocean IMO showed better results in one of my old systems compared to AM and a few other cheaper brands I played around with. :)
     
  16. Manic

    Manic Moderator

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    When I test the TM though. I get kH of 6 and calcium of 330 and magnesium of 1100. This seems a bit low... This is at a sg of 1.026 and with elos test kits...
     
  17. Mekaeel

    Mekaeel Moderator MASA Contributor

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    Ok no doubt, those levels are seriously low. lol. Have you tested the AM as yet?
     
  18. Manic

    Manic Moderator

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    No just bought it. I'll do a full test tomorrow with both salts at the same temp and salinity and let you know the results. Maybe I got a bad batch...
     
  19. Mekaeel

    Mekaeel Moderator MASA Contributor

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    Cool thanks man, looking forward to those results.
     
  20. Adee

    Adee

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    I've got the Salifert test kit...and here's the crunch even with a fresh batch of sw It did not pickup levels of Iodine, the biochemists reckon something about "elemental" iodine, vs Iodide...something of that nature. Anyways, test kit was money down the drain.

    Anyways don't stress on the iodine, your high alk levels did exacerbate the problem. When I kept my alk around 11dKH, I could not get my Ca to go past 380ppm no matter how much Ca I dosed. You would notice a high level of precipitate around the water level area on the glass and heaters.

    It was ..... Real Ocean. I've since heard that they have sorted out their stuff. I had to "dump" a 100kg's of the stuff. I'm using the Tetra Marine 20L buckets and quite content with their product. Instant Ocean for me though is THE salt but has become pricey. Also, rumor has it that Tetra Marine and Instant Ocean salt come off the same factory floor. :whistling:
     
  21. Broder

    Broder Thread Starter Mudshark

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    To update, the stn has become rtn. I fragged the coral 2 days ago, but don't have much hope that anything will survive. It doesn't seem logical that whatever is causing the parent colony to die will not effect the frags as well. One just feels so helpless as you don't even know what's causing the rtn. I'm going to look into dosing iodine if I can find a test-kit.
     
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