Please help selecting "right" CLS pump

Discussion in 'Pumps and Waterflow' started by RiaanP, 18 Jan 2010.

  1. RiaanP

    RiaanP Moderator

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    I got the holes, so I just as well can setup the CLS...

    I'm setting up a tank, 1.5,0.75,0.75
    I bought the tank, looks brand new. But it is secondhand.
    It have the CLS outlet in the back, in the bottom of the back glass and slightly off center. 50mm hole. And there are 2 return holes (32mm) in each bottom corner in the back glass.

    On the outlet, inside the tank I installed a T-piece, with 50mm pipes either way with 200 little 6mm holes to suck water in. That is completed.

    Returns, So far my idea is to have a 32mm pipe enter straight into the tank, about 400mm, with a T piece at 200mm and a 90 elbow at the end. Same both sides. So that I have 4 streams of water blowing from the sides into and up to the rocks.
    OR
    I should opt for only one exit per side with a 45 elbow and halve the pump needed.

    So each outlet should be at least 2000L/h to be of some use. So my minimum requirement for 4 exits are 2 pumps of 4000L/h. Or one central pump with at least 8000L/h. On 2 exits, everthing halves.

    But the pumps available for CLS systems are actually crap, if you compare the water delivery against the wattage used.

    And as my rich uncle died many moons ago, PRICE is also an issue.

    So what do you guys think is the best option?
    One bigger central pump, or 2 "smaller" pumps - one a side and less return plumbing and less back pressure. And if one fail, the other is still going.

    And which pump/s. Please keep in mind the water delivery against wattage used.

    And must be external. Must be able to mount it upside down (under tank) or sideways. (sideways - less return plumbing)

    And should be realistic in price.
     
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  3. vatso

    vatso

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    Hi mate

    I do not know much about these things but my new tank will have more pumps rather then one big pump - I would rather have some flow then no flow if a pump breaks
     
  4. leslie hempel

    leslie hempel Moderator MASA Contributor

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    im in a simular decision making process and am exploring the reeflo pump option they are approc 100 - 120w for approx 13000lph delivery by far more competitive in wattage for water delivery than any other pump i have discovered or seen..

    i am currently using 2 s OR3500 (3500lph x 65w x 2) and am having space issues below the tank..

    while i love the OR3500's i think im going to have to explore the reeflo concept.. i am also looking at removing all pumps out of the DT and placing a Ocean motion squirt to better uitilise the pressures and flow produced by the pump..

    nice neat and simple..

    good luck i know its not an easy decision..
     
  5. RiaanP

    RiaanP Thread Starter Moderator

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    Leslie, 2 questions.
    Where or who stock Reeflo pumps and at what price? And which model (I thing you are refering to the Dart)

    And where do you source the Ocean Motion Squirt and at what price? I did keep the option to use one open as an alternative. But then obvioulsy I should use only one pump for the CLS.

    O, that was more than 2 questions...
     
  6. leslie hempel

    leslie hempel Moderator MASA Contributor

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    dory stocks Reeflo dart /supergold /hammerhead they are the same pump just different members in the range.. was referring to Dart you are correct.

    OM is a tricky one im looking at DIYing something but have spoken to one or two guys to get a price on getting them in. i have seen a supplier claim to get them in for R3600 but i wasnt too happy with their lack of confidence in even identifying the product over the phone.. so im sure i can DIY something it may take time though..

    i have really been trying to sorce something energy effiecient for long term saving but this will be quite prict to implement in the short term
     
  7. Neil H

    Neil H Moderator MASA Contributor

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    Riaan, and Leslie, i am also assessing the possibilities for pumps for a CLS

    there are a number of options, but if you want to keep the elec bill down then the options become fewer and fewer and generally more expensive...

    the water blaster and bubble blaster pumps by Reef Octopus look like a good option but are pricey !

    Water blaster options

    HY5000 = 5000Lph @ 60 watts
    HY7000 = 7000LPH @ 88 watts

    i think there could work well, but they are skimmer pumps and i dont know how they will respond to turning on and off or how they will perform with any significant head or many bends in the CLS

    I am working on a CLS with no 90 deg turns, only 45 degs .... and i think this is KEY
     
  8. Jaco Schoeman

    Jaco Schoeman MASA Contributor

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    Riaan, dont think you saw this, but just read through this thread of mine on CLS.

    Closed Loop System (CLS) Review - Pumps and Waterflow

    My advice to you is to get as big pumps as possible for that size tank. You saw my tank and CLS and I am running two 5800lph pumps on only five outlets.

    Also, and trust me on this, get high pressure fittings pipes, otherwise you will have leaks. Use as little 90deg bends as possible, as you will not believe the flow loss you get by using 90deg bends. Invest in unions and valves, they do make life much easier.

    Now, after all that has been said and done, I personally feel that, unless you REALLY want a CLS, powerheads are a cheaper option to go with. My CLS cost me around R1500-R2000 (fittings and pipes only) to build, and I have a much smaller system than that. My pumps cost me R1300 each, so that is almost like having a Tunze system, and the pumps are 90W each!!!

    Do not underestimate the cost aspect, and do not go for cheaper alternatives like normal PVC...

    Shout if you need further assistance, but read my thread, it should help. ;)
     
  9. RiaanP

    RiaanP Thread Starter Moderator

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    Lanzo should update his website, cannot find anything under Reeflo on his search...


    Thanks Neil. Have to check them out. Yes, no 90 degrees seams to be a key.

    Yes, Jaco. Did read your thread this morning. Yip, and I do agree, the water turnover against wattage used and for the effort and proce do not really make a CLS a good option. Can get a lot of SunSun pumps for the a lot cheaper and less effort. BTW, a 3000L/h SunSun use 6W for under R3000.

    Bubble Blaster for example, at 7000L/h it uses 88W. That is equal to 14 SunSun and at 42000L/h. And it will be at R300 equal to R4200. That is one hell of a difference.
    :(
     
  10. Jaco Schoeman

    Jaco Schoeman MASA Contributor

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    Exactly what I 'm talking about.

    BUT...

    IF you build the CLS right, you have amazing flow type, controll and it is LS (ESPECIALLY nennie) safe. But one has to look at cost and effort, not only initial, but over the longrun too.
     
  11. seank

    seank

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    Closed loops works well with a pump on each side- your waterflow out of all the outlets are more constant. I did the same in my tank. A pump on each side, connected to each other, but with a lot of outlets in between
     
  12. leslie hempel

    leslie hempel Moderator MASA Contributor

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    they are new to Sa only a few pumps came in in Dec so they will be on sale soon..
     
  13. vatso

    vatso

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    What's the advantage of a closed loop?

    Mark
     
  14. seank

    seank

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    random flow with more outlets inside the main display
     
  15. vatso

    vatso

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    I still don't see the advantage? I understand the random flow - but if one was to run a few 2000Lh pumps in ones tank would this not give the same result? does the water that leaves the system with the CLS get cleaned in anyway?
     
  16. RiaanP

    RiaanP Thread Starter Moderator

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    Nope, pump suck out of display, pushes directly back into display. No pump head or lift, so you get all or almost 100% flow that pump is rated for (90 degree bends being only limiting factor).

    Advantages, (what I can think of quickly)
    • Anemone safe.
    • No unsightly pumps in display
    • No heat transfer.
     
  17. leslie hempel

    leslie hempel Moderator MASA Contributor

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    Advantages of CLS

    Pump life is longer owing to no head height pressure
    As mentioned safer for tank inhabitants (anemones)
    Hidden, no pumps in tank

    Disadvantages
    expensive initial outlay
    Fixed entry points so planning must be well done prior to positioning.


    feel free to add to the list
     
  18. seank

    seank

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    Follow the yellow and orange to understand it better:

    [​IMG]


    Another sketch:

    [​IMG]
     
  19. seank

    seank

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  20. vatso

    vatso

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    The idea is more to remove pumps from the display which makes sense & Anemone Safe.

    What one needs is high volume low pressure pump

    Just interested to see the plumbing on this how one get's all the pipes in & out? or do you run 1 pipe in & split it in side the tank & 1 pipe out?
     
  21. RiaanP

    RiaanP Thread Starter Moderator

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    No other pump suggestions?
    Criteria in short

    Affordable
    Maximum flow rate
    Minimum Wattage Used
    External
     
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