NSW vs RO & salt water

i cannot become 1,i wish i could:)

You know why you cannot become a sponsor. You are a "box"! Forgot the africaans word for box. :whistling:
 
Now, this is the best example of using RO water and salt, from SunnyX.
It inspired me to use bacteria and carbon. Can I get the same result using NSW?

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A definite NO! Unless you stock your tank with softies only. To do softies only its easy, to do stony only its easy too, but to mix soft and hard corals, thats the most difficult way to go. All about the nutrients level. I have seen a absolute stunning soft coral tank in the netherlands and was shocked about the filtration. The skimmer was way to small for such big system, but softies like it a bit dirty. Me too.;)
Mixing soft and hard corals in a "drop of water" makes it so difficult. Look at natures reefs. Fields of softies or fields of stonies are the norm.

This thread is really good, BTW.
 
Maybe its just because i live at the coast and try for large regular water changes that i am confused and with all due respect I hear what you are saying, IMHO softies and stonies both grow in ULNS in nature. So why would they both not do well in a mixed reef tank. But I know it is difficult in our small closed systems. Maybe someone has a link explaining why both don't do well in our system once Ulns has been achieved or would kindly elaborate.
 
I think i am just being defensive but will add to this if a person does large water changes often I cannot see how this will put parameters out. Less testing required, less additives required.

Continuous large water changes will surly result in more stable conditions, mimicing natural water conditions or the conditions of your mix. Equilibrium will most certainly be achieved with large regular water changes?

I put it this way, try do 30 % water change a week for 3 months and tell if your parameters are not rock solid and your corals are not looking great. But then again weekly large water changed can become a pita but definately worth it.

I use NSW, so it must be better than synthetic :) its straight from the best source. Not saying that synthetic cannot mimic it but it's not the same thing. Natural or synthetic just do it often.

Does mr sunnyx not live inland and have to use synthetic mix?
 
Seabass - again i must stress it depends where you get nsw from there are areas of ocean which have no coral reefs , while this is temp dependent , the nutrient levels also differ,if you do frequent water changes then you may approximate local conditions but not have the right nutrient profile for a tropical coral reef
 
Seabass - again i must stress it depends where you get nsw from there are areas of ocean which have no coral reefs , while this is temp dependent , the nutrient levels also differ,if you do frequent water changes then you may approximate local conditions but not have the right nutrient profile for a tropical coral reef

Makes scene, did not think of that, hope EL water will do. Thanks Achilles. My water changes are driven primarily to get my nitrates down. SunnyX what is your point of view please.
 
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I collect water In Hermanus,its very clean and has so little nutrients I struggled to test it.I do filter my water before I add them to my tank. I must add about 10% ro water to reduce the salinty. I also add a kh buffer.(ca once in a while and mg once a month or less) Been doing it for almost 2 years and Ive never lost a coral.touch wood.I also dose very very little) It all depents where you collect nsw from. We lucky here in Hermanus coz there no big harbours,not alot of traffic(from boats) and I stay less than a km from the beach. But if I had to drive half an hour to get water I wouldve mixed asw.its just so easy and convenient here. Why dont we all do tests (ca,mg,no3,po4,kh,salinity and ph) post it here and we can compare the water collected in different areas.Then we can see how different water is from different areas. Ill do it when the weather clears up.hopefully tomorrow. I believe in nsw,coz its free and convenient.
 
09/08/2011 NSW test
Sea temp a whacking 16 degrees.
SG 1.024, same reading from two separate hydrometers. So I am happy with a consistent reading.
Now to the testing, added 1lt NSW to a water bottle and added it to the sump to bring temperature up to 23 degrees before I did the following tests:

8, thought it would be lower

Mg 1140 ppm, this seems very low

Ca 380 ppm, also low

Ph 7.4, strange, would have expected a higher reading

No3 0-2, slight bit of pink, so not zero

Po4 0 this has restored my trust in saliferts Po4 test kit

From this little test, should I be happy with the source of NSW, just flipping cold.
 
09/08/2011 NSW test
Sea temp a whacking 16 degrees.
SG 1.024, same reading from two separate hydrometers. So I am happy with a consistent reading.
Now to the testing, added 1lt NSW to a water bottle and added it to the sump to bring temperature up to 23 degrees before I did the following tests:

8, thought it would be lower

Mg 1140 ppm, this seems very low

Ca 380 ppm, also low

Ph 7.4, strange, would have expected a higher reading

No3 0-2, slight bit of pink, so not zero

Po4 0 this has restored my trust in saliferts Po4 test kit

From this little test, should I be happy with the source of NSW, just flipping cold.

sorry I havent given you mine yet. will do it asap.
 
Thanks for these test Seabass, now I don't have to do them myself.

Here is a interesting thought: Looks like it's only temperature that would prevent corals from growing in the sea at East London. Let's say we can heat the water to 26, there should be no problem having coral reefs in East London?

09/08/2011 NSW test
Sea temp a whacking 16 degrees.
SG 1.024, same reading from two separate hydrometers. So I am happy with a consistent reading.
Now to the testing, added 1lt NSW to a water bottle and added it to the sump to bring temperature up to 23 degrees before I did the following tests:

8, thought it would be lower

Mg 1140 ppm, this seems very low

Ca 380 ppm, also low

Ph 7.4, strange, would have expected a higher reading

No3 0-2, slight bit of pink, so not zero

Po4 0 this has restored my trust in saliferts Po4 test kit

From this little test, should I be happy with the source of NSW, just flipping cold.
 
We can also use Adee's tank as a reference for synthetic salt. Just as good as SunnyX's reef and it has been running for a longer time:
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I asked an authorized distributor of Prodibio the following:
I am using Prodibio in my reef aquarium and is very impressed. I am using NSW (natural sea water) for water changes and is very worried about the bacteria in the water. What can you recommend in treating the water if neccessary at all or will Biodigest get rid of all the bad bacteria?

His response:
I would ozone treat any NSW prior to putting in a reef system, it is not just bacteria you need to worry about its also any pathogen, put an air stone with a water pump in the NSW container and leave running for an hour, in a very well ventilated area. After treatment leave for 24 hours for the ORP to reduce back down with the pump only running.
 
Interesting thread, since my new house is now a 2 min walk from an awesome beach I have been thinking of going to NSW from RO with added salt.
Looks like there is no true answer in this thread and all I can do is try it and see what happens!
 
Boegie the ozone use is a very good idea for treating NSW, but also in a tank like Sunny X i bet he has good potasssium levels as well as that contributes to the colour, many people who use inappropriate NSW for tropical reef aquariums say they are having success but they are keeping corals like softies and LPS which dont mind a higher nutrient laden water not sps like in Sunny x or Adee's tank.

I reiterate i would like to see any sps tank run on cold atlantic NSW that looks as good without having to treat the NSW in a big way.

Using NSW that doesnt come from a tropical reef region means one would probably have to add buffer, magnesium, potassium, strontium to name only a few if one intended keeping SPS corals

Using East London water may have better results but still you dont have many tropical reefs down there sub -tropical but not tropical, so again you will have higher nutrient laden water from the start using nsw
 
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Try it Dizzyg. I am using NSW purely for cost saving. Used it since I started reefing and have no experience using synthetic. Now you have the ideal situation to share your experience with us.
 
Thanks Achilles. My biggest consideration then should be, is to choose my corals wisely if I want to carry on using NSW. Being a mixed reef, I should also keep my nitrates above 0 as in the region of about 4 - 5 and dose additives. Please correct me if I am wrong.
 
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(Double post.) Here you can see some of the corals that are thriving in my reef. Also have 2 sticks of SPS that is starting to grow.
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Those corals should be fine in East london water but i wouldnt expect roaring success with SPS, SPS need very stable conditions with alkalinity and other parameters staying very stable, i dont think you would get good colour with East London water either out of SPS.When diving on Plettenberg bay reefs you see alot of filter feeding sea fans and softies but very little hard corals , temperature and nutrients in the water determine if SPS grow , even in tropical conditions Sps die and algae smothers the reef if nutrients get out of hand and that happens in the ocean so you can expect similar results in the closed confines of an aquarium because "the solution to pollution is dilution."

Believe me i wish i could use NSW here in Cape Town i tried and its fine for fish systems, mushrooms , zoanthids and Softies ( but even then requires some changing of parameters mainly buffing)but if you want to keep SPS corals you will be far more successful using Salt mix and R/O unless you live in Maurtitius or Seychelles or the Red Sea for examples :thumbup:

To change NSW here to tropical conditions would require treating it and using some pollution removers and adjusting its chemistry which can turn out to be more complicated than using a commercial salt mix and R/O , people keeping mixed systems with mainly softies and LPS can usually have some success though with NSW.

Here is a picture of SPS corals kept in a pond using NSW but guess where- The Red sea is only metres away , the only thing done to the water is some mechanical filtration. it works because those corals actually live there in nature

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Thanks again Achilles. Would like to call upon @Kunhardt and @Mudshark - you have some lekker sps growing in your tanks. What water do you use for water changes?
 
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