NSW vs RO & salt water

Discussion in 'General Discussions and Advice' started by Boegie, 14 Sep 2011.

  1. Boegie

    Boegie

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    I wanted to make the thread title "bacteria in NSW vs RO & salt water" but I think that other differences are relevant.

    I am striving for a LNS using bacteria (biodigest) and carbon source (vodca). And use NSW. Now, NSW also contains other bacteria, good and bad.

    When using RO water, quoted from Wiki: "In practice, a fraction of the living bacteria can and do pass through RO membranes through minor imperfections."

    I would like to open a discussing on the differences of these systems.

    Is there any marine biologists out there that can talk about what good and bad bacteria come with NSW?
     
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  3. Evo R

    Evo R

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    Tagging along on this one :p
     
  4. Boegie

    Boegie Thread Starter

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  5. Boegie

    Boegie Thread Starter

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    Now, this is the best example of using RO water and salt, from SunnyX.
    It inspired me to use bacteria and carbon. Can I get the same result using NSW?

    [​IMG]
     
  6. Seabass

    Seabass

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    MHO, NSW, how can you beat this.
     
  7. Boegie

    Boegie Thread Starter

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    SonnyX beats NSW. So far, anyway. I want someone to come up with a tank using NSW to beat his system. What I am trying to figure out is the correct method when it comes to bacteria.
     
  8. Glynn

    Glynn

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    i use both methods... if the nsw conditions are not good ..rain/rivers down etc then i use salt mix with rain water(through ro) .. my observations are that when i do lots of nsw the sps looses colour but the lps/softie side goes well. and visa versa. I dont believe the bacteria loads make the diffs but rather the very high levels of organic iodine in nsw.
     
  9. Boegie

    Boegie Thread Starter

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    Thanks Glynn. Proves my theory that the types of water we use have different approaches to reefkeeping. For example, maybe I should dose a fail of biodigest every week instead of every second week to make biodigest the dominant bacteria strain.
     
  10. 2balive

    2balive

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    What, if any would be the risk of this?
     
  11. coswecanfly

    coswecanfly

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    I don't like dosing anything and with all the plankton in NSW my corals are thriving and everything else is happy as can be... I'll never go over to salt mix...
     
  12. Achilles

    Achilles

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    It also depends where you get the natural sea water , cold atlantic water has different nutrient levels to the Indian ocean warmer waters hence the kelp that thrives in nutrient high water.

    There are lots of corals that are negatively affected by bacteria species like vibrio etc. In fact much coral disease consists of bacteria both in the wild and in aquariums.I am also of the opinion that adding bacteria by the bottle doesnt mean you sometimes wont be adding harmful specimens, i doubt whether all the cultures made for the hobby are always done in ways that contamination is not possible, In the ocean Scientists have recently discovered that the sewage that enters the ocean even after being treated has bacteria which kills corals this is what causes white pox disease in corals and this bacteria is found in human faeces.


    Also because we are dealing with closed systems the composition of the water in an aquarium quickly changes vs what it is in the ocean, so if one is using nsw , one will have to often buffer more and supplement more and do more water changes than with salt mix( of course this also depends on the salt mix they are not all equal)

    Can you get the sunny x aquarium with nsw , imo you cant. Sunny x aquarium is LNS and that means you have to export more( including bacteria via skimming) than you add, you never know what you adding with NSW in terms of organic and inorganic nutrients. Only time NSW would work that well is if it is taken by a region that has endemic coral reefs as this water has the right nutrient profile, the nutrients are tightly cycled over a reef.
     
    Last edited: 14 Sep 2011
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  13. Arries

    Arries

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    Hmmm tagging along...
     
  14. Seabass

    Seabass

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    No way, only one person who beats NSW and that is Chuck Norris.
     
  15. Reefhead

    Reefhead

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    Salt Mix for me beats NSW for the simple reason that NSW comes with "bad" Bacteria in the form of diseases, etc
     
  16. erle_vaughan

    erle_vaughan

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    I've heard of guys treating NSW with JIK to kill all the bacteria and then letting it stand for sometime to let it all settle and then using the water and leave the last 10% or so in the bottom.
    I think they also then treat it with with a anti-clorine/cloromine/cloride.... :confused:

    I'm not so sure about it all... maybe google or chuck norris have the answers
     
    Last edited: 17 Sep 2011
  17. 459b

    459b Moderator MASA Contributor

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    i fully agree with this. When using made up salt water, you know exaclty what you adding and can adjust things accordingly. With NSW, the composition will change all the time. How many guys using NSW actually test the water before adding it? And i dont mean simply testing salinity, i mean pH, ALK, nitrate, etc. The whole idea that the ocean has perfectly stable parameters is a bit of a myth.

    With regards to "bad" bacteria - there are alot of opportunistic pathogens out there. They might be fine, and even beneficial, but given the right (or wrong) conditions/circumstances and they can turn nasty very quickly. With the number of species added with NSW and commercial products, you dont actually know potential pathogens you introducing into your system.
     
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  18. roderigo

    roderigo

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    Nice topic tagging
     
  19. williet

    williet Look at the shiny LEDs!!!

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    Wanna see where this goes...
     
  20. Achilles

    Achilles

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    Having used Cape NSW for 16 years from the Two ocean and later from the research aquarium, i found constant nutrient problems and many types of different nuisance and macro algaes proliferating , i turned to salt mix in the end as i started to keep corals , as while nsw is great for Fish systems, i found one has to add too many other supplements to get Cape NSW suitable for reef aquariums - more phosphate remover(gfo is expensive) than when using salt mix and more buffer as well as other supplements, then if one factors in time/ petrol/effort( big for me 1000 litres per month) = almost the same expense as the buying a good salt mix, one still has to supplement but not as much and definitely less algae problems.

    If one has super filtration systems eg. tons of liverock, oversized scrubbers massive skimmers then perhaps it would work but i havent seen any Cape town aquariums even public ones keeping tropical corals in Cape NSW and having incredible success, now if you compare that with Durban's water for ushaka there are many great tanks there with tropical corals but they also have great filtration and are not closed systems but semi-open ones so you cant say their success would mean it will work in a closed system either

    Glynn's tank is absolutely superb eg of a reef aquarium and he uses salt mix and also NSW as he stated but he is near tropical Reefs with Durban NSW and he did state some corals do better in the NSW than others more specifically the Lps and not the sps which only get those pastel colors under low nutrients
     
    Last edited: 14 Sep 2011
  21. Nemos Janitor

    Nemos Janitor

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    Hmm.....and this only affects NSW? what about LR?

    Does LR not contain bacteria? Good? Bad?

    Are we looking into an era of sinthetic rocks juiced with "good bacteria" ?

    Enjoy the debate :biggrin:
     
    Last edited: 14 Sep 2011
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