LEDs for lighting.

Discussion in 'Lighting' started by CheshireCat, 21 Apr 2009.

  1. CheshireCat

    CheshireCat

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    Hi

    I'm currently starting up a reef tank (hopefully :p) and have been considering the lighting. I've visited numerous sites and MASA's very own forum on the arguments for the lighting system. I've read about the MH and T5s and LEDs. I must say LED lighting is very attractive and also very expensive, however, the cost-benefit makes it an ideal choice for me. I'd rather pay through my arse once off than in smaller doses over the same lifespan period of the LEDs, which is about 11 years (at 12 hours per day, on daylight setting). I live in Cape Town and have the fortune of having a Communica not too far from where I stay and L.E.D. Lighting SA not far from that. L.E.D. Lighting is a LED lighting manufacturer and can make up custom orders. They use high powered LEDs in their products and are a reputable company (http://www.ledlighting.co.za/); some of their LEDs come from Seoul Semiconductor Ltd. and Osram. Communica down the road has 4W high powered LEDs (100lm, 6300k).

    So what I would like to do is get a quote for a lighting system for my 1,5m x 0.6m x 0.6m tank, which incoporates the needed spectrum of light which benefit corals hard and soft, fish and humans. So thats a coulour range of about 6500k (yellowy white) to 20,000k (blue).

    • Could anyone give advice on the number of LED's I would need to sufficiently light my tank and promote coral growth.
    • Recommend the PAR I would need.
    • Recommend the light spectrum distribution for growth and viewing, e.g. 70% white/30% blue for example
    • The number of lumens you would recommend for a reef tank (Keeping in mind that the high-powered Seoul's start at 100lm and can go up to 900lm (max; 700 normal) per LED .
    • Any other details I may have forgotten and that you think I will need to know and ask for.
    My motivation for wanting to use LEDs is to get energy and heat cost down but also save money over the long run. What we have is good enough (MH and T5's) but it can be better. Hopefully if L.E.D. Lighting SA don't charge to much they will find a new demand in a new market sector. With time these things will be cheaper but I'd be willing to invest now for the long run.

    I'll keep everyone updated on this thread when you guys give some advice and speak to L.E.D. Lighting SA.

    Cheers for now.
     
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  3. jacquesb

    jacquesb Retired Moderator

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    WOW CheshireCat! That sounds AWESOME! If you can get this done successfully, PLEASE keep us up to date with EVERY step!

    Just take the total WATTAGE into account that you would require.... Also - how deep is your tank? I think that this will work if your tank is NOT TOO DEEP....

    Regarding PAR - unfortunately I cannot answer you.... BUT, I know that my 3 x 150 watt metal halides works a charm!
     
  4. RiaanP

    RiaanP Moderator

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    Google solaris aquarium lighting

    Somewhere I did come across the spec for the LEDs that are used in a solaris. Must search for it again. Each LED block got 25 LEDs, 6 actinic blue / day, 9 white, 6 blue night and 4 white night. And there are 1 block per 12 inch as the Americans have it, or about 30cm. So for a 1.5m tank you should look at 25 * 5 = 125 LEDs

    Remember the heat sinks, and built in fans, as the LED do get super hot. But it is a lot less that MH globes. Minimum 3W LED should do it. 4W should be better. Then also check the spread angle of the LED. Must be around 20 degree. That will be enough to work on a 600 front to back tank. 600 deep should be OK. As Solaris website do give the PAR readings at different depts. And each LED must have own resistor, unless you are really good with electronics to work the loads out correctly.

    48" PFO Solaris-I5 15K LED Lighting Fixture

    It seems that their official website is down tonight. Must check tomorrow.

    You even get brighter LEDs, like in instant blindness. I've been to Comunica and did check it out end of last year. But then it was about R50 a LED, and too expensive. But salesguy did mention a cheaper China import comming at about R25 each. Those might be cost effective. 125 * 50 = R6250 for LEDs only, no power supplies, fans heat sinks or resistors (cheap resistor under R2, nice looking one at R9 per LED). So I were looking at at least 10 grand then I still have to build it myself. Soldering 125 leds resistors etc... Not for me. But if the LEDS are cheaper, maybe then...

    good luck. If you can do it, I'm interested.
     
  5. moz

    moz

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    I've also looked into LED lighting, I've even bought the components for a test unit (25 leds) for a nano I plan on building. The lenses and holders, are only a bit cheaper than the LED's. I can't remember what lenses the solaris light use it was either 45 or 60 degree lenses. Part of my plans is to add pulse width modulation to allow me to control the brightness of the lights so that I can simulate sunrise sunset and moon phases.

    My LEDs and Lenses
    [​IMG]
     
  6. FransSny

    FransSny

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    awesom moz...ive beentinkering with similar ides for a while now would like to know if you get it right...im just not thecnical enough!
     
  7. ADVdiver

    ADVdiver

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    If I am not mistaken the silfilgo fitting has 189 X 3w check this out[​IMG]
     
  8. silver phanton

    silver phanton

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    what is the lighting spectrum for the normal LED lights at builders ? the White and the blue?
     
  9. brettb2020

    brettb2020

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    gee that silfilgo is hectic! Does led lighting have a high par rating? Enough for sps?
    Posted via Mobile Device
     
  10. lIghty

    lIghty

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    Would be much better to rather using a current limiting device;)

    What they set you back I you don't mind me asking:whistling:

    Why not use a PIC with a current limiting circuit to control the LEDs, could use it to control the PWM and "offset" on the blues and white to get the correct colour......

    LEDs are not as easy as everyone thinks, not just a case of a LED and a power source, they can (most times) require complex circuitry to drive them:whistling:
     
  11. jacquesb

    jacquesb Retired Moderator

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    I am following this topic with interest...
     
  12. seank

    seank

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    I would also be very interested in doing Alida's tank with LED lighting only. Anyone out there who can build me a set with controller for moonlight, sunrise etc.?
     
  13. moz

    moz

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    I think the LED's where about R25 and the lenses about R15 (When the rand was R7 = $1). I plan on using to an "arduino" as a controller as it looks easier to learn than PIC. I have had help in the design of the circuits, which includes resistors, FET's and transistors.
     
  14. lIghty

    lIghty

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    Tell me about it:lol:
    Cool, just let me know if you need any help.;)
     
  15. CheshireCat

    CheshireCat Thread Starter

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    I've been speaking to a friend about the controller for the lighting in the tank. I understand that the the lighting effects is only really beneficial to us and the fish (Sunrise-Full Day-Sunset-Moonlight), what I would like to do is grow coral and therefore need more specific lighting requirements. AS I've said my friend will be able to make a controller fro the above mentioned lighting effects. What I need to know is how much light is needed to sustain coral (using my tank as a example: how myuch light or lumens/wattage/or such will I need for a tank of 1500x600x600). I'll need this info before I go to LED Lighting SA to give me a quote.

    Also as a side my dad works for Griffon Hovercrafts in the UK and they use high powered LEDS as Spotlights. The unit consists of 3 LEDs and produce 5000 lumens, the cost per one unit 324 pounds Sterling:eek:

    I've been reading up on the lumen ratings for 400W Metal Halides, which are between 18000 to 25000 lumens. This is also the light output which the PFO Solaris unit gives off? I've read that the Solaris is equivalent to a 400W MH in light intensity, is this correct.

    Some help in this area would be awesome, I've seen some pretty bright (but low powered) LEDs. That Silfilgo which ADVdiver posted has a total usage of 567W and if each LED produces approximately 80 lumens then thats about 45,360 lumens, which about the equivalent of 3 x 250W MH's. Are the lumens as important as the frequency of the light itself?

    More info would be agreat help working with LED's and comparing then to MH's or even FL's is a confusing task.

    Cheers
     
  16. lIghty

    lIghty

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    bit comfused, 80 x 189units = 15 120 lumen:whistling:
     
  17. jacquesb

    jacquesb Retired Moderator

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    Hi CheshireCat - you are QUITE spot on with your information. The Lumens is indeed extremely important. BUT, for the general hobbiest, Lumens and PAR does not mean a THING. As no-one really has the expertise, neither tools, to measure in Lumens, nor PAR.

    I hope that someone with more specialized knowledge than myself, can assist you here.
     
  18. RiaanP

    RiaanP Moderator

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    Actually it is about the PAR that is important. The amount of light that penetrates to different levels in the water.
    Lumens is light intensity for human eyes...
    Kelvin is colour temperature - actually colour range of the light, red yellow to blue actinic

    Check up freshwater plant keeping, on some of those sites are a lot more info needed about the real difference kelvin, lumens and PAR
     
  19. lIghty

    lIghty

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    Moz, what are the specs on those LEDs you have?
     
  20. moz

    moz

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    I've got white and blues, he whites are 5500k ~80 lumens, and the blues 465-470nm ~30 lumens.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    DC Forward Voltage (VF): 3.6 ~ 4.0 Vdc
    DC Forward Current (IF): Typ 650mA (Although the available drivers are 700mA)
    Power Rating: 3W
     
  21. lIghty

    lIghty

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    sound good
     
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