Emperor in bad shape

Discussion in 'New Members' started by O-Ring, 14 May 2012.

  1. O-Ring

    O-Ring

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    Hi everyone
    Not sure if anyone can help,but my Emperor is in a bad state and has got worse.I have a picture when it was blotchy but now it even looks like it has Popeye,with fin rot.It has been in my tank for about a year and has had no problems to date.I have done 35% water change and checked all parameters everything is OK.The other fish are Semi and Convict tang both are in great shape.I moved it into my other tank unfortunately it has only been running for one week,it was doing better the whole day and even got color back only to find it worse this morning.Any help at this late stage would be appreciated.!
     
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  3. leslie hempel

    leslie hempel Moderator MASA Contributor

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    please stste your actual parameters as well as food being fed, is the fish eating?

    be cautious of moving an ailing fish as it could worsen the outbreak but make sure if you do move him the water is exactly the same as where he was transferred from to reduce stress, i would personally syphon water from the main display (if it were of good quality) and set up a bucket quarantine facility where a copper medication can be introduced to assist..

    the main thing is to properly identify the disease or the cause of the disease... and treat accordingly..

    just note that skimming and UV may need to be suspended during treatment should you have a quarantine system with these fitted...
     
  4. 459b

    459b Moderator MASA Contributor

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    Welcome to MASA!
    A pic of the fish will help alot. Were the emperor and semi fighting?
     
  5. O-Ring

    O-Ring Thread Starter

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    Hi
    I have tried to attach but the file is too large, the semi is a third of his size and really dont fight besides a few grunts.I have been feeding them blood worm roe mussels and some spinach leaves.He was eating well until two days ago then started to slow down and go to the cleaner shrimp all the time.
     
  6. O-Ring

    O-Ring Thread Starter

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    [​IMG]
     
  7. Wes

    Wes

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    Shame man i hope he comes right. poor fella
     
  8. leslie hempel

    leslie hempel Moderator MASA Contributor

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    could be a combination of things,,

    something to check is salanity, and nitrate specifically.. at a glance it could be HLLE (head and lateral line errosion starting but it does seem a little more complicated than that because of the cloudy eyes..

    are you feeding a vitamin?
     
  9. Broder

    Broder Mudshark

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    Is it twitching violently from time to time?
     
  10. O-Ring

    O-Ring Thread Starter

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    @ Leslie..I have been putting vitamins on the food I had checked HLLE symptoms but had not started like described (pitting?) my salinity was high but under control at about 1024. @ Broder...Yes he was twitching violently. (Shaking his head)
     
  11. Lord_Blackadder

    Lord_Blackadder

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    Twitching, cloudy eyes and blotchy skin are the main symptoms of flukes. Pomacanthus are extremely prone to them. Treat with praziquantel. It's safe with pretty much all inverts except tubeworms and can be done in the display.

    If you want to confirm the diagnosis then do a 5 minute freshwater dip. You'll see the flukes dropping off the fish.
     
    Last edited: 14 May 2012
  12. Broder

    Broder Mudshark

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    Your emperor's most likely suffering from the worst case of flukes that I've ever seen. The symptoms are classic.

    Usually flukes are not deadly and are found in most tanks. They are kept under control by cleaner shrimp and wrasse etc, and good water parameters. If the infestation becomes as bad as your emperors, there is a danger of the fish contracting and dieing from a secondary infection. Another problem is that if you treat the fish, there is a risk of it bleeding to death as all or most of the flukes release their claws from its skin, leaving holes in it.

    There are various treatments, the only one of which I've tried with limited success, is treatment of the tank with Prazipro. You could also try a freshwater dip to start with. I think you will need a lot of luck as well, and I'm holding thumbs for you.
     
  13. O-Ring

    O-Ring Thread Starter

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    Interesting!thank you. Im not sure how strong he is at the moment and need to go home and see.Will the freshwater not stress more and what about the fin rot is it all associated with flukes?
     
  14. Broder

    Broder Mudshark

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    Yeah... the flukes normally show as blotches on the fins first, and are often misdiagnosed as white spot.
     
  15. Lord_Blackadder

    Lord_Blackadder

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    +1

    Once they get really bad then the fins start to take a hammering.

    On the plus side, if the fish survives the first day or two of treatment, it should make a rapid recovery.
     
  16. O-Ring

    O-Ring Thread Starter

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    Hi all thanks for the help.I have given it a freshwater bath and seen plenty come off.My problem now is he has gotten 10 fold worse since this morning.(attaching picture)Where do I get these Praziquantel or Prazipro?

    [​IMG]
     
  17. Broder

    Broder Mudshark

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    I don't know if any of the suppliers here stock it? I got mine from Wantitall.
     
  18. Broder

    Broder Mudshark

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    It's stressed and bleeding, but you're doing the best that you can.
     
  19. Lord_Blackadder

    Lord_Blackadder

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    You can get praziquantel from a vet. It's used to deworm dogs. Just be sure to get straight praziquantel, some of the worm treatments have multiple active ingredients.

    I'd get some metronidazole and dose that at the same time as the praziquantel. It'll take care of secondary bacterial infections and other external parasites that could be taking advantage of the open lesions on the skin. Seachem make one that seems to be quite freely available from petshops (in KZN at least). It comes in a little plastic cylinder.

    While you're there you might want to get some methylene blue. It makes freshwater dips a lot safer by increasing oxygen levels amongst other things.
     
    Last edited: 14 May 2012
  20. crispin

    crispin

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    great info in this thread guys, thanks so much for sharing.

    O-ring, holding thumbs that the reduced fluke pressure allows him some strength back and that he makes it through the treatment.
     
  21. O-Ring

    O-Ring Thread Starter

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    Hi guys....again.Can anyone tell me how to treat/dilute what I have purchased from the vet.Its called Prazifen which contains 50mg Praziquantel and 500mg Fenbendazole?i am sure he wont be eating.It is in a 300lt tank.
     
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