Urgent help needed Dream tank turned into nightmare

Discussion in 'Urgent Help Needed' started by Fenton, 21 Dec 2014.

  1. Fenton

    Fenton

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    Hi Guys,

    Where do I start,

    Ever since I've been in this hobby (2yrs)I always dreamt of owning a tank from idol marine,well mine was delivered on Friday.

    So here's what I did,

    On Friday I did a tank transfer from my 1.2m (250L) (going to be set up as a quarantine tank)to my 1.5m(520L) tank.I had the balance of this water mixing about 2 hrs)

    Took the maximum amount of water from my old tank to my new tank, about 220-230L,transferred all my live rock about +- 100kgs(had tons of coraline algae growth so I know my tank was doing well)

    All my live stock was in a polystyrene box about 3ft long at 25 degrees with a small power head.

    Live stock:

    Regal tang
    Blonde tang
    Green mandarin
    6 line wrasse
    2 percula clowns (orange)
    2 black orcillaris clowns
    And about 6 corals

    All livestock was doing awesome eating like pigs in the old system.

    I switched the system ON about 1:00 am Saturday morning to cycle a bit.

    Yesterday afternoon about 16:00 I bought a yellow tang as well ,so I transferred all the livestock to the new system(it's now round about 17:00)

    After the transfer every body was doing what they do,

    Yellow tang was a bit shy
    Regal was hiding and acting the whey they do in a new setup
    Blonde was swimming freely and getting used to his new environment.
    Clowns,wrasse and mandarin was moving about as normal.

    This morning when I got up I couldn't see the blonde and the yellow tang,so I just thought they were hiding or sleeping,

    Came home about 18:00 this evening Yellow tang and blonde tang DEAD.

    Regal is definitely not going to see tomorrow,can barely swim.

    All the others are looking fine,eating,etc

    Parameters:

    SG = 1.025
    Temp: 25
    Ammonia :0
    Nitrate =0
    Nitrite =0
    PH =8.3
    Alkalinity =9
    Used about 3 x 9kgs of new aragonite and 1 jug of my old sand to seed.

    Now here's a spanner in the works,

    I checked a video on YouTube stating that when starting up a bio pellet reactor,you should load pellets gradually and if you have overdosed the pellets your water will be very murky (mines was very murky until I switched off the reactor,and then the water cleared very quickly)also I'm speaking under correction that if you overdose a bit of toxins are released into the water column.

    I have a JNS alpha 2 reactor with just under half way filled with bio pellets.

    What did I do wrong?
    Why only the tangs?

    Awaiting your advise and thoughts
     
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  3. carlosdeandrade

    carlosdeandrade

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    It sounds like you got a bacterial bloom. It wasn't the pellets as these take time for the bacteria to grow on. Are you dosing any bacterial additives like stability or MicrroBlift?
    I would do a 80% water change. Make sure your water is at the same temp as your tank, and that salinity is correct. Come get water from Idol.
    Personally, you might have done things are bit too fast.
    Tangs have a very small surface area on their gills compared to the body size and they will always be first fish to suffocate from lack of O2 or NH4 poisoning.
    Never switch off your pellet reactor.
    Bacteria take a very long time to grow properly, even seeding with one jug wont be sufficient as your sand bed is a major source of your biological filter.
     
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  4. RiaanP

    RiaanP Moderator

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    maybe a stupid question, but when you moved the fish from the box to the tank, did you drip acclimatize them?

    I prefer not to use polystyrene boxes or cooler boxes when moving fish from one tank to another. Reason is that the water temperatures at the end of the move differs too much. Water in the tank and in normal plastic tubs would be cooler.
     
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  5. Fenton

    Fenton Thread Starter

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    Morning guys,

    Thank you for the replies,
    @carlos ,I added about 25ml of special blend,will come through to Idol later to get some Water
    @ Riaan ,I dripped them for about an hour ,tripled the initial water volume.

    I forgot to mention that I used some of my old sand To set up my new refuguim.

    I'm going to the tank now,going to check if there are anymore casualties.

    :(
     
    Last edited by a moderator: 26 Nov 2015
  6. zayd

    zayd

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    Sorry to hear. Can't offer any advice other than large water change.
     
  7. 4age

    4age

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    Sounds like oxygen depletion. .could be a combination of things which with the tank transfer lead to the bloom.tangs do require very well oxygenated water which is often why they generally the 1st to go when oxygen levels drop
     
  8. dallasg

    dallasg Moderator MASA Contributor

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    my guess would be ph shock and agree with carlosdeandrade
     
  9. Chris Makings

    Chris Makings

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    Just a question, don't you think you might have a had a mini cycle? with new sand and moving the rock around and the pellet reactor?
     
  10. dallasg

    dallasg Moderator MASA Contributor

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    its a possibility, but his test show 0, so the LR was still acting as a biological filter.

    ammonia can dissipate quick but maybe the levels were high for a short period

    O2 depletion seems the logical guess, seeing as that alot of the water was new and maybe not aerated enough
     
  11. Chris Makings

    Chris Makings

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    O2 depletion seems the logical guess, seeing as that alot of the water was new and maybe not aerated enough[/QUOTE]

    I understand that, but as mentioned it was mix two hours before, but when you add water to your tank don't you think that will also aerated it abit? Plus with your skimmer and everything else going it should have helped. Please correct me if I am wrong.
     
  12. Nemos Janitor

    Nemos Janitor

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    Was the salt mix used a high Mg salt?
     
  13. dallasg

    dallasg Moderator MASA Contributor

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    while i think there is a difference between adding bubbles to water and actually increasing dissolved oxygen, we can often mistake the 2, gaseous exchange is what we are after, not only adding O2 but removing CO2 and many others, hence that old adage of aerating new water for 24hrs after making.
    here is an interesting read relating to recirc systems etc
     

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  14. Fenton

    Fenton Thread Starter

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    I expected when I got to the tank this morning I would need to take out a dead regal,to my surprise the regal is more active now than my older tank,

    He eating nori +he is gobbling up the pellets I fed
     
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  15. Chris Makings

    Chris Makings

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    Perfect thank you, I was really miss understanding that, don't mean to High jack your thread @Fenton, I was just not understanding how it could of been O2 depletion.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: 26 Nov 2015
  16. Fenton

    Fenton Thread Starter

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    I used Seachem reef salt to mix,had it in a drum with a RW15 circulating
     
  17. Nemos Janitor

    Nemos Janitor

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    Whilst some salt brand manufacturers say that their salt mixes immediately and can be used immediately after mixing, I am not sure it is wise to. As Dallas says the gas exchange needs to balance. Hi Mg salts will produce Ammonia on mixing and pH will be all over the place.

    I will be doing a very similar tank transfer method as to the one done in this thread. Striping my 800lsofty tank and upgrading to a 1700lI. Started mixing 2000l this morning in my mixing drums and will fill the tank tomorrow.
     
  18. Fenton

    Fenton Thread Starter

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    @chris ,not to worry i think it's really awesome that the guys on masa really want to understand the issue when you are in a crisis
     
    Last edited by a moderator: 26 Nov 2015
  19. Raimund

    Raimund

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    Condolences on your nightmare Fenton ! A friend of mine had the same issues - transferring all livestock, rock and sand to a new bigger tank within 24hrs. Fish deaths, and then the others got whitespot. Reasons unknown and confusing !

    I think regardless of any theories, a new tank must cycle for a few weeks before you can add fish, even if they go with original rock, water and sand. I recently moved from 250 l to 1500l with no losses - just let the new tank cycle and then balance all parameters with the old tank. I did not even need to transfer any water.

    Good luck - things should stabilize now
     
  20. dallasg

    dallasg Moderator MASA Contributor

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    i dont think weeks are needed, i have done this over many year with many tanks and never lost, there are some things that can prevent mishaps but its the chance we take.

    also there is not always the luxury of having 2 tanks running at the same time which does increase the risk.
     
  21. dallasg

    dallasg Moderator MASA Contributor

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    please explain? I dont see how Mg, whether MgCl or MgSO4 can cause NH4
     
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