Confused...........(Sump layouts)

Discussion in 'General Discussions and Advice' started by jagman, 18 Nov 2008.

  1. jagman

    jagman

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    Morning all,

    It is probably due to lack of sleep but here is the question....

    Everything that I have read so far states that the DSB is responsible for pulling all the bad stuff out of the water that flows over it. Does it also eat up all the fish poo and leftover food ?

    The protien skimmer also cleans out all of the larger stuff out of the water that flows through it.

    Would it not be an idea to put the skimmer after the water has flowed over the DSB ?

    Whats the general rule when it comes to Sump design and WHY ??
     
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  3. scubaninja

    scubaninja

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    it doesn't have to be before the dsb, it could be after, but before may be better as your skimmer puts a lot of bubbles into the water and that goin into your dt isn't so nice, but it may also be that your skimmer converts some of the nasties into a substance that the dsb is now able to break down further. just my opinion, i may be wrong:)
     
  4. jagman

    jagman Thread Starter

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    A protein skimmer or foam fractionator is a device used mostly in saltwater aquaria to remove organic compounds from the water before they break down into nitrogenous waste. Protein skimming is the only form of filtration that physically removes organic compounds before they begin to decompose, lightening the load on the biological filter and improving the water's redox potential.


    According to this all that the skimmer does is remove large organic waste. If the DSB requires all of the bad stuff in the water to function properly, why remove it before it gets there ? Does it not make sense to put the skimmer after the DSB ? Improving the waters ability to draw in oxygen just before it is pumped back into the DT will benefit marine life surely ?
     
  5. scubaninja

    scubaninja

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    no it doesn't remove everythin. it removes a large portion but not everythin. you must remember that there is water constantly draining into the first compartment, so some, as in a portion of water that has just flowed into the first chamber will then immediately go into the dsb. and hence the dsb will be kept 'alive' by that portion of water. the water remains oxygenated for a while until somethin in the water uses up the oxygen, what we don't want is the big, visible bubbles entering the dt. so it goin before the dsb gives the bubbles a chance to escape
     
  6. DragonReef

    DragonReef

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    No, a sandbed does not remove poop and detritus. In fact some refer to them as nutrient sinks. There are some critters that live in a DSB / Refugium that will consume the waste but for the most part it accumalates over time.
    There have been some heated debates over the years with regard to DSB's.

    The main function of a DSB is as a biological filter that breaks down nitrites and nitrates.
    The skimmer will remove dissoloved organic waste from the water. It's the first line of defense whereas a DSB or other biological filters will serve as a filter aid.
    The truth is in a closed system the water is continuously being polluted and we try to employ every means of filtration that we can.
     
  7. jacquesb

    jacquesb Retired Moderator

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    Hi Jagman - as DragonReef said - because a marine aquarium is, firstly, a closed aquarium system, and secondly, there are FAR FAR less "natural" nutrient export mechanisms (ie when compared to fresh/bath water tanks), we have to explicitly add as MUCH methods of filtration to our tanks as possible.
    This includes adding a skimmer (mechanical filtration), a DSB (biological filtration), live rock (biological filtration), an algae "Scrubber" / macro algae (biological filtration), nitrate remover (chemical filtration), activated carbon (chemical filtration), phosphate remover (chemical filtration), (sometimes) filter-wool (mechanical/manual filtration), etc....

    In you tank's sump - you can decide whether you want to have the DSB / refugium first (before the skimmer), or AFTER the skimmer (2nd)..... Some people feel that the micro critters (pods) that makes the DSB very useful, get's skimmed out by the skimmer if the skimmer is AFTER the DSB - therefor they place the DSB after the skimmer (the skimmer 1st).

    I think that it should be tried out, and then every individual reefer should decide themselves what they want to do.....

    My sump was not designed by myself, and I have my sump DSB BEFORE my 2 skimmers..... And I still get micro life into my tank...... so - for now, I won't make any changes.... it seems to work for me/my tank......

    PS: My 2 ReefTek TS2 skimmers works so well, that if I do NOT overfeed, I have VERY VERY low nutrient levels in my tank - so much so, that my soft-corals do not want to grow..... So - I have explicitly decided to start overfeeding - now my soft-corals are growing again, BUT, my nitrate levels are higher (+-20ppm - before I overfed, it was around 1 to 2ppm)....
     
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