Closed Loop System

Discussion in 'Pumps and Waterflow' started by Brucemg, 19 May 2008.

  1. Brucemg

    Brucemg

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    Hi All

    A topic of interest, Im still a junior in reefing and need to find outa little more how do all the reefers out there feel about CLS, yes or no.
    What are the pros and cons regarding CLS, is it pratical or is power heads the answer.
    Photos of reefers who do have CLS so as to see the diversity of designs etc.;)
     
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  3. Matt

    Matt MASA Contributor

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    CLS's are great in my opinion! can be VERY effective if set up properly. And no powerheads means your tank is anemone safe.

    My next tank will be 100% CLS
     
  4. Brucemg

    Brucemg Thread Starter

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    Here is my CLS design. I will be using a Hailea HX-6550 immersible rated at 5580l/hr.Calculation estimates a jet stream velocity of approximately 0.3m/sec with 7 exits with a internal diameter of 40mm. The outlets are able to rotate to direct the stream. Is this sufficient or to little.
    What do the power heads push?
    Please comment

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  5. Matt

    Matt MASA Contributor

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    Is the tank already set up? Why not have the CLS go under the LR etc?
     
  6. Brucemg

    Brucemg Thread Starter

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    Hi Matt
    Tank not yet built only the sump, waiting for $$$ to arrive. Im taking my time at the moment dont want to rush still learning.
    I haven't given the CLS much thought of hiding it between the LR yet but thanks for the suggestion.Im busy testing with two outlets in my sump at the moment as its just standing. The water flow is reasonably strong thru the two outlets but I think I might have to use two pumps if there is 7 outlets.
    I want to connect another pump this weekend and see what happens. Ive also DIY a front nozzle which is flat at the end with about a 5mm opening 30mm wide this seem to jet the flow a bit more.Ill take some photo a post tomorrow.
     
  7. Punk

    Punk

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    hey bruce, looks very very cool man, it looks like your return might siphon your tank when the pump is off, perhaps just drill some holes in the vertical pipe to break the siphon...
     
  8. Punk

    Punk

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    oh & it looks like you're planning a typical calfo manifold, to get max flow guys typically minimize the use of 90 deg elbows, personally i would replace each of these
    [​IMG]

    with just a T-piece slanted at a downward angle & a 45 deg elbow...
     
  9. Brucemg

    Brucemg Thread Starter

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    Thanks PUNK
    Yes there will be a siphoning hole and the 90 bends should actually be 45 could not sort it out on sketchup.But your idea of tilting the t-piece in excelent will do so, did not think of that:thumbup:
     
  10. sunburst

    sunburst

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    Yes..I don't yet have one, however i do plan on making one, and would like to hear opions and advise from others



    Pros
    1)Noise levels greatly reduced within the tank. If you have watched Nemo you will know what i mean. ie place your ear up against the glass and listen. More natural JB:)
    2)A source of heat is removed from your water.
    3)No bulky plastic chunks of streamlined foreign art work scarring your carefully engineered sea scape
    4)One pump needing maintenance and not half a dozen

    Cons
    1)Lack of chaotic flow. Or rather no chaotic flow.
    2)The type of volume related flow that the modern heads produce cannot be equaled. Couple that with some of the timers and wave making devices now available; make Heads irresistible.
    3)Lots of pipe work. Someone here, Cannot remember who' referred to their nano as looking like a refinery. A CLS will make your tank look like Dexters Laboratory.
    4)Should your CLS fail unexpectedly you will be without flow...well until you plumb in that new Red Dragon (please Santa i been a good boy)
     
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  11. Brucemg

    Brucemg Thread Starter

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    Hey Sunburst great feed back thanks. So pros and cons are even.Yes and lets hear and get advise from the other reefers who have or like us intend to have CLS .Interesting discusion so far anyway.
    To achieve chaotic flow in the tank what would one do, maybe increase water flow by increasing pump flow rate or maybe having two pumps with timers, dont know just a thought.
     
  12. sunburst

    sunburst

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    Thanks for starting the thread
    All is not lost ,as there are some clever people that came before us that have considered the same questions. They all revolve around the same principal. Alternating current. Google these devises and you should find plenty. The one that i have bought is the Oceans Motions Fourway. Also Google "Penductors" They ramp up the volume of flow as apposed to the velocity of flow.
     
  13. Brucemg

    Brucemg Thread Starter

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    Sunburst hows about a pic of your system,there is also a mecahnical one that Ive read about but cant find it, something like "SWDC" or what ever but not sure. Maybe someone can shed a light on this device.
     
  14. sunburst

    sunburst

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    Sorry dude, i have bought the Oceans Motion, and am now saving up for the Red Dragon. Currently just using heads and two SCWD connected to my return pumps.

    Nothing to take pictures of.
     
  15. Brucemg

    Brucemg Thread Starter

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    No Problem, did you import the Ocean Motion or buy local?
     
  16. sunburst

    sunburst

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    Unfortunately the local demand for this type of equipment, no matter how beneficial, is just not big enough. I had to import it. There are smaller units that are a lot more cost effective. Even by the same company and others. They just cannot handle the massive volume.
     
  17. Brucemg

    Brucemg Thread Starter

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    On a CLS what is needed velocity or volume to cause water movment.
     
  18. sunburst

    sunburst

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    Hmmm...no definitive answer for that...But what has been assured is that, 1)random chaotic flow 2)Volume as apposed to velocity.
    If you crank up one you should crank up the other.
    From my meanderings through the net i feel that if you plan on running a powerful CLS, then a current alternating device is the most economical in terms of set up costs and power consumption.
     
  19. Awvince

    Awvince Here fishie fishie

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    Another downfall on a CLS is the wattage needed to drive the big pump needed for a CLS. I used a pool pump and that was 400w and only did approx 12000lph. Something like a seio uses less than 20w and does something in the region of 4000lph
     
  20. Singularity

    Singularity Hmmm amper!

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    that is exactly where the [​IMG] comes into play, if only u can get one...
     
  21. Brucemg

    Brucemg Thread Starter

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    How do these work are they attached to the outlet of the CLS. Im busy with DIY nozzles made from 32mm tubing and attached to a test CLS using a Hailea HX6550. When I get hold a video I will post, as this seems to work.The shape is that of a flat ended pipe with groves filed in, and the velocity is amazing. The loop is only about 600mm head and about 1m long with two outlets
    </IMG>
     
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