Advice on a new sump for 2 cupboards

Discussion in 'Biological/Natural Filtration and Deep Sand Beds' started by mnd123, 14 Jun 2009.

  1. mnd123

    mnd123

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    After a lot of frustration with my current 2 sump design, I have redesign and rebuilt my new sump

    Issue I had: 2 cupboards with a solid wood devider, this made me decide on the current design:

    [​IMG]

    As you can see, the inlet enters sump 1 on the right, where I have activated carbon, the TS1 and a phos reactor. This sump is in the dark to avoid algae growth and the like. It then flows via a pump to sump 2 on the left which has a playsand DSB with Chaeto as well as an Arogonite DSB with some LR as a refuge. Then it pumps back to the tank via the last chamber which also has an auto top up in it.

    The problem is simple, the Auto top up. To keep those chambers aligned is impossible.

    I have finally built the sump and need a little more advice - I bought the glass at Builders Warehouse Rivonia, all cut and edges polished for R230/sq meter for standard clear 6mm.

    Holes drilled by Edwin at Idol Marine, and much advice on where to put holes and how many delivered by Adriaan, Rob and Louis, thanks crew.

    [​IMG]

    Finished product - RHS cupboard

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
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  3. mnd123

    mnd123 Thread Starter

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    and here is what I planned to do - baffle in RHS sump to make sure that detritus is channelled to the skimmer, surface skim to sump LHS over the DSB (notice I have angled to elbow joint, and baffle before the return.

    [​IMG]

    What you think? I have a 2000l/hr return, do you think I will have too much flow over the DSB? Will I get massive amounts of detris over the DSB with the surface skim?
     
  4. mnd123

    mnd123 Thread Starter

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    I also built my frag holding tank that will be on the old LHS sump with DSB and refuge above (PIC ONE) - I decided not to try and move the aragonite to the new sump.

    [​IMG]

    I will put a baffle into the tank before the overflow (again surface skim) and put the skimmer into the overflow chamber as I will not have space in the sump which has 2 x DSB

    [​IMG]

    What do you think? Is it a good idea to re-use a working DSB and refuge?
     
  5. Reef Maniac

    Reef Maniac MASA Contributor

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    That should work very well. Only recommendation I would make would be to consider raising the right hand sump by say 100mm (if possible) to allow for a bit of "head£ to help with the flow through the connecting pipe. If you don't do this the right-hand sump could run a lot fuller than the left hand side (which would not necessarily be a problem...).

    Yes, if it is not more than a year or two old - if older, then just use 10% or so to "seed" the new sand.

    Hennie
     
  6. RiaanP

    RiaanP Moderator

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    THis is how I connected two sumps, works 100%
    50mm pipe, Upside down U, with ends cut at an angle to prevent it from being blocked
    [​IMG]
    And the 6mm flex black pipe goes to a venturi on one powerhead
    [​IMG]

    This will keep the syphon.
    And I found the water level on both sides stay the same.
     
  7. mnd123

    mnd123 Thread Starter

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    Thanks Hennie - I will try and do that, the reason I have pool hose between the sumps is so that I dont need to be exact.
     
  8. mnd123

    mnd123 Thread Starter

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    Riaan, I have the sumps connected like this at present and it gives me endless pain after power outages and the like - the return on the right is 1900l/hr and on the left 2000l/hr and as the pumps age I have to continuously adjust the ball valves I installed to get the levels constant - and then the auto-topoff either works too hard or not at all.
     
  9. mnd123

    mnd123 Thread Starter

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    A question on having the skimmer INSIDE the frag setup - I have it in a seperate chamber so that I can get the full benefit of the DSB and Fuge with respect to pods etc for the coral - question is - do I really need a skimmer in a frag setup?
     
  10. Reef Maniac

    Reef Maniac MASA Contributor

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    If you have a decent DLSB, then "no" for softies and LPS, and "yes" for SPS... IMHO

    Hennie
     
  11. mnd123

    mnd123 Thread Starter

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    Thanks Hennie - this is SPS so guess I should do it, hell I have the TS1 and never used it....
     
  12. jacquesb

    jacquesb Retired Moderator

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    WOW! Neat sump mnd123! I am really impressed! Is that correct? Do you ONLY have a TS1 skimmer?
     
  13. mnd123

    mnd123 Thread Starter

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    Jacques, I have a TS2 currently running in the sump on the main display, I will put this TS1 pictured above in the frag setup

    In the first pic you can see my TS2 incorrectly labelled as a TS1 - only when I got this second hand TS1 did I realise my original one was in fact a TS2
     
  14. RiaanP

    RiaanP Moderator

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    No, I do not balance pumps in my setup. No need to, and it is giving me no problems. Only one return pump in the sump. The syphon ensured that the water flow with no problems at all. Only problem is when I take the powerhead out to clean it, then the pipe must stay BELOW water level. And putting it back I have to make sure that the venturi faces the correct diection.

    But my point is that the 50mm pipe my water flow fast enough on its own through the syphon. I also got the two tanks at slightly different levels as Hennie suggested, but I found that the water levels stay the same in both. So I seriously doubt that you need to lift the one. Unless your connection downsize from 50mm.

    You can always test it before going "permanent", just fill both, put mother of a pump in last chamber that pumps directly to first chamber and go ahead. Just do it outside in case you flood the kitchen and get the government upset.
     
  15. mnd123

    mnd123 Thread Starter

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    I have 50mm thanks Riaan

    :) indeed - goooooverment is already upset with me for spending money on new sumps :)
     
  16. mnd123

    mnd123 Thread Starter

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    Thanks Jacques :)
     
  17. mnd123

    mnd123 Thread Starter

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    Well - had the longest Friday night and a very pi$$ed wife - but almost there!

    First had to remove the old sumps - MAN what job with that closed top sump that I had in there - impossible - had to take a ball peen hammer to it and break it!

    Here it is before I removed left and right sumps

    [​IMG]

    And after fitting the RHS sump - made an error when measuring and needed to cut that 50mm joint down by half on both sides

    [​IMG]

    And with both sumps fitted, slap me silly but joining them with pool hose was impossible, after 3 hours of fighting eventually at 10PM covered in PVC glue I resorted to a 50mm PVC pipe, and that took just 5 minutes

    [​IMG]

    An the surface skim and return in sump 2

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  18. mnd123

    mnd123 Thread Starter

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    Oh - and the extra project - the frag tank - MUCH easier than the sumps!

    Fresh water test

    [​IMG]

    and the full setup

    [​IMG]
     
  19. RiaanP

    RiaanP Moderator

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    Just keep an eye on your water params. You removed the tanks heart, and new sump must still became active.

    And I wondered how you will do the pool hose. ;) Sealing it will not be easy.

    Anyway it looks a lot better. I wish whoever still sells that stupid closed sumps will wake up... Old school, but OK for fish only systems.
     
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  20. mnd123

    mnd123 Thread Starter

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    Thanks Riaan, I have a pretty deep sand bed in the tank, but will certainly watch my params - great advice
     
  21. mnd123

    mnd123 Thread Starter

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    a few concerns where I would appreciate you advice on

    1) As you can see the water lever is very high, and because I could not raise the sumps (see previous PVC covered response about pool %^$&*^^%^ hose) there is very little head - is this water level ok for a sump?
    2) Skimmer is working - just wanted to check the water level with you all - that ok?
    3) There is very little movement of the detris in the Left hand sump - with the DSB I am putting in there this weekend is that ok?
    3) I am running a 1900l/hr return, should I upgrade it?
    4) I want to put an algae scrubber in the left hand sump, will put new lights in - what would you recommend for that sump - energy saver preferable?

    Thanks all!

    M
     
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